SickthingsUK

Great to see that "Grim Facts" has been added to the setlist, but disappointed that Alice kept "gay bars" in the lyrics. Admittedly, I didn't think a thing of it back in 1980, but then I was 12, and attitudes about homosexuality were quite different then. Hearing the line today (implying as it does that the mere existence of a gay bar on your street is comparable to social ills like armed children and teenage pregnancy) is cringeworthy. Why not swap it out with something else, like "porn stars" or "drug czars"?

Anyway, my 2 cents. To those who strongly disagree with my opinion, please keep your flamethrowers set on low, and try to criticize the ideas rather than stoop to ad hominem attacks.

....then how long will it be before he has to change...”Schools been blown to pieces”

As openly demonstrated by way too many people these days in the U.S. and the UK, a gay bar on a street would still be upsetting to the people addressed in "Grim Facts." Their attitudes about homosexuality are still stuck in the 1950s, just as they were when this song came out in 1980.

It sorta depends, in my opinion, if it's meant to mock concerned parents or is actually meant to be cautionary.

I agree with the last couple of posts. As Alice brilliantly does in so many songs, I think he’s actually bringing to light how ridiculous it is that people DID (and still do) fret about “gay bars on their street.”

I find this to be a rather interesting situation, because I definitely could see how in the 80s, Alice was mocking the worldview of the conservatives who were afraid of where the world was heading which has kind of come full circle also. I know that Alice has tried to stay out of the political world, but it is known that he is a Christian and in ways leans conservative, so I could definitely see how it could be troubling for some people to hear him saying such.

I suppose you have to assume that the lyrics and their potential interpretation in the current environment would have been considered at some point before the song was played on stage. If so, I am well prepared to believe that Alice is mocking the attitudes which are still visible today though maybe not as much as before.

The world has moved on but still has a long way to go yet. Only last year there was a local uprising when a "malicious rumour" suggested that the route of the annual pride parade route might be changed to pass through a different street. Paraphrasing a quote but it was very clear that "we can tolerate that behaviour over there but certainly not in over here".

Keep the lyrics as they are. They may not have been written that way today but they still have relevance.

so you think gay bars are not cringeworthy, but porn stars are?
the lyrics shouldn't be changed at all. the very fact of adding "on your precious street" is sneeringly directing that comment to people who are stuck up enough to be offended by a gay bar. it's still totally relevant.

guttertrash wrote: ↑

Tue Sep 04, 2018 10:59 pm

I find this to be a rather interesting situation, because I definitely could see how in the 80s, Alice was mocking the worldview of the conservatives who were afraid of where the world was heading which has kind of come full circle also. I know that Alice has tried to stay out of the political world, but it is known that he is a Christian and in ways leans conservative, so I could definitely see how it could be troubling for some people to hear him saying such.

Pretty much sums up my thoughts as well. I mean I think it's meant to be mocking but it's certainly not as clear cut as some other lyrics.

Alice has enough difficulty with lyrics live. Don't make it worse.

The real problem is fans wanting to dictate what an elderly man may or may not sing as a song lyric - and even worse, to question if he committed a thought crime due to intent. What a slippery slope that could become. I don't like what I see when a dog lifts it's tail, but I ain't going to chase one down with a permanent marker to make things more agreeable for me, either.

...no one blinks an eye at the beheading of a senior citizen every night. Odd.

Bang on Padre.

Wont bother mentioning the point being missed since everyone else has.

rgallie wrote: ↑

Tue Sep 11, 2018 9:44 pm

Wont bother mentioning the point being missed since everyone else has.

The point is that AC tried once again to give us die-hards what we want and the nit-picky complaints began. Most of us have been guilty of this at one point or another. I can point back to a lot of my own posts and feel like a horse's ass about them. Not a great feeling.

People on here love a moan!¡ The song lyric is OBVIOUSLY having a dig at ultra conservatives who think gays are abhorrent the same as " the queens are out dancing but now they're not funny cos there goes one walking away with your sonny" genius. Learn what satire and social comment is!! At very least have the intelligence to realise that on grim facts he is on the side of the "gay bars" and not those who look on at as "your precious streets" I would love to see this live again. Classic. Now where is my mangina??

Well said dadascot.
Its a great little tune and its a great line. I dont think any of alices lyrics are "bad" in the sense we are talking about here, (not "pissed-off-istic" bad ahhaha) Alice is a great lyricist and tbh i wouldn't want it censored either way.
Shame i havent heard this tune live did he swap out something else for this to slide in?

Saint&Sinner wrote: ↑

Fri Sep 28, 2018 12:33 am

Well said dadascot.
Its a great little tune and its a great line. I dont think any of alices lyrics are "bad" in the sense we are talking about here, (not "pissed-off-istic" bad ahhaha) Alice is a great lyricist and tbh i wouldn't want it censored either way.
Shame i havent heard this tune live did he swap out something else for this to slide in?

He swapped out Be My Lover, which has always been one of my least favorite songs.

Padre, sometimes one single sentence makes it on a song to me : in Be My Lover, it's : you really wouldn't understand.
(and than that look in his eyes, on The Night Mare Returns, snake on his shoulder ... hmm, precious